怎样说服要求CB证书的客户接受CE证书？

xiaojie786

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客户是一家外资灯具厂商，在这边有中国的制造基地，产品全球销售，他们的整机产品是经过CB认证的，可能考虑到全球销售必须使用CB报告在各国转换吧以节省成本；我们公司提供灯具上的连接器，客户看了样品后明确说可以用但要我们连接器的CB证书，但目前调查下来很有压力，因为这种连接器的标准IEC61984被授权的NCB和CBTL都在国外，代价很高啊，报价在50000PMB左右，而做公告机构的CE证书成本只要10000RMB左右；因为关于这个连接器产品CB和CE的测试标准是完全的，从产品安全要求声明的角度来说，CB和CE证书是等效的，而且我们作为提供零件直接面对客户，不是直接面对全球市场，没有必须取得CB证书然后各国转化的需求，难道CB要求是从整机包含到零件吗？整机达到CB要求是否零件一定要CB要求呢，用其他的安全认证是否可以，我们和如何同客户谈判？

小鸭的天空

应该是可以接受的,参考以下IEC的决定:

嘻嘻

不接受CB的，因为会增加随机测试费用

xiaojie786

引用第2楼嘻嘻于2009-03-20 08:56发表的  :
8 q+ y& J6 j, J不接受CB的，因为会增加随机测试费用

你是说不接受CE吗？以下是IECEE CB零部件认可原则部分内容，谁能解释说明一下零部件没有CB报告其他证书是否可以呢？
5.1.2 Component without a CB Test Certificate
- f9 l/ U  |: R8 _5 e$ NWhere a component is not provided with its own valid CB Test Certificate for
/ @+ W3 |% q, Q" d, {compliance with a relevant component standard it shall be checked for correct
# |2 p: R3 I. P  G' g4 @. kapplication and use in accordance with its specified ratings. It shall be subjected to the
- a6 ^7 _& u; y3 Oapplicable tests of the end-product standard, as part of the end product, and to the
applicable tests of the component standard, under the conditions occurring in the end
3 p: \. _# T2 j  O/ |6 A4 oproduct. In order to ease the process of acceptance, the applicable tests from
component standard shall be reported in the Test Report for the component and
* F4 h9 z: V( F9 d9 S9 H/ Pattached to the end -product CB Test Report. The following acceptance situations shall
( N+ f3 o" y/ r# s+ v/ Lbe considered:
( R$ E& Z. `/ Q4 S0 i7 J5.1.2.1. No additional requirements for the component in the end-product standard
6 M% R) T3 `' ]7 T# I6 Q& E9 ?. Z5.1.2.1.1. No National Differences declared for component
- Component shall be accepted by receiving NCB provided that component test
: |! H/ ?6 k( |0 f/ ireport to IEC standard is available from the issuing NCB.
+ G# ]4 a9 U" C2 A' p+ m* Y" Z$ v5.1.2.1.2. National Differences declared for component
- Component shall be accepted by receiving NCB provided that component test
) M0 c/ n( Y9 x7 ~0 @report to IEC standard is available from the issuing NCB and includes National
; H- h7 u/ m  d9 n1 J+ B  R& G7 ODifferences, otherwise
- Component shall be accepted by receiving NCB when information provided in
7 `; H) E7 W2 G& kthe Report fulfills acceptance criteria declared by the receiving NCB in the CAM
& B( a: [+ J& M8 e) tdatabase, otherwise
% w, L, V4 `3 T- L- Component accepted by receiving NCB after additional evaluation addressing
+ y: P% C: L7 WNational Differences.
5.1.2.2. Additional requirements for component in the end-product standard
+ K5 ^, e9 J6 C- V) t; _; g4 d' M5.1.2.2.1. No National Differences declared
- Component shall be accepted by receiving NCB provided that component test
report to IEC standard is available from the issuing NCB.
5.1.2.2.2. National Differences declared for component
Same as 5.1.2.1.2.
5.1.2.3. Component provided with a national certificate, which indicates that, the
component was tested to a harmonized standard and it shows limitations and/or
6 t9 X, N# G4 bconditions of use.
2 S& s0 A3 |( q. |3 u! e1 b- Component shall be accepted by receiving NCB provided that any additional
4 m# j5 O. |3 o. x- `2 crequirements (i.e., National Differences, end-product requirements, applicable tests
of the component standard, under the conditions occurring in the end product) have
been addressed in the end-product report.
5.1.2.4. Component tested to the requirement of a non-harmonized standard
- Component accepted according to the procedure of OD 2036, when used, or
- Component may be accepted at the discretion of the receiving NCB.
5.1.2.5. Component tested to the component requirements in the end product only
% l7 N3 `0 v  u+ B% X(not tested to the applicable component standard)
4 H4 x6 P  P5 @$ `: G$ Z* n2 R- Component accepted after additional evaluation to the applicable component
requirements, where necessary.
: B- \! {* P+ n1 a) d( ]- B5.1.2.6. The receiving NCB does not adhere to IEC component standard.
2 O& ?) d* o/ Y" ]4 n- See 5.1.1.4.

嘻嘻

5.1.2 Component without a CB Test Certificate
Where a component is not provided with its own valid CB Test Certificate for
$ K9 A7 H' Y2 w9 l+ B5 C" k6 icompliance with a relevant component standard it shall be checked for correct
4 q# Q' c6 ^  i: ^6 ?: _9 iapplication and use in accordance with its specified ratings. It shall be subjected to the
# m* a! g4 S% ^. X7 t1 a! h& Capplicable tests of the end-product standard, as part of the end product, and to the
# o$ w7 E5 F/ X6 iapplicable tests of the component standard, under the conditions occurring in the end
product. In order to ease the process of acceptance, the applicable tests from
component standard shall be reported in the Test Report for the component and
attached to the end -product CB Test Report. The following acceptance situations shall
be considered:------颜色部分的意思是，如果没有相应的CB 测试报告的话，则必须做为终端产品的一部分做相应的测试。对这个零件的测试报告作为终端产品的CB测试报告的附录。
3 T# l" I: Y" Z$ v# D欢迎大家讨论

xiaojie786

引用第4楼嘻嘻于2009-03-20 09:36发表的  :
! V0 F& \# B7 S+ @9 }; k# T5.1.2 Component without a CB Test Certificate
Where a component is not provided with its own valid CB Test Certificate for
compliance with a relevant component standard it shall be checked for correct
application and use in accordance with its specified ratings. It shall be subjected to the
, o5 P4 S3 j5 B& b+ w) U( U' e8 C# fapplicable tests of the end-product standard, as part of the end product, and to the
% [3 H2 ^7 r4 i7 B.......

是啊，作为整机的一部分，测试是一定要做的，CE测试和CB测试标准及项目相同，所以我想提供CE证书是应该可以认可的吧？

嘻嘻

引用第5楼xiaojie786于2009-03-20 09:59发表的  :

( |1 ]  }: R$ \: v: L3 g& z' I是啊，作为整机的一部分，测试是一定要做的，CE测试和CB测试标准及项目相同，所以我想提供CE证书是应该可以认可的吧？

CE的测试标准是EN标准，CB测试标准是IEC，两者一般来说是没什么大的区别。
* G: y1 C% O7 l0 y' Q但是有时会有国家偏差。
这在你引用的资料里面也有体现

sinmk

你要用GB测试项目CE测试项目进行标准同的分析来说明给客户,再用一些实验检测来证实.......
必要时可以用一种协议来规定:CE认证来替代GB认证检测的项目得到的认可.

xiaojie786

引用第6楼嘻嘻于2009-03-20 10:02发表的  :

0 I  G3 t; u% v+ @2 {+ C( @CE的测试标准是EN标准，CB测试标准是IEC，两者一般来说是没什么大的区别。
0 K: `! s+ t3 d! [- ~( V但是有时会有国家偏差。
$ ?+ g) l2 J& X$ K" }) H这在你引用的资料里面也有体现

恩，明白，但我查了一下这个连接器测试标准IEC61984没有地区或国家差异，这样的话就不用做差异测试就可以说明了吧？

xiaojie786

咨询了一些认证机构和工程师，好像也没有明确的结论，有的说不行，CE的效用不如CB，有的说还要看客户要求，客户认可就可以，谁能有个明确结论以解惑呢，谢谢！